Soooooo..

[Evil Parsnip]

How is the new DC lineup? I believe, that the reboot started, is it as bad as we all feared? Someone please give me a hint.

[Jabby J]

My LCS says things are flying off the shelf in a matter of hours, which is good for him and DC I guess. But the over all quality of the books I hear is 50/50. One thing that seems a little shady is that in the Justice League, if you opted to get the more expensive baged version, there was a code for a free book or something to download, which had the owner in a tizzy. And with good reason in my opinion. You don't give a customer a coupon to someone else's shop down the street who is selling the same thing. That is just bad business...

[jaydeebee]

How is the new DC lineup? I believe, that the reboot started, is it as bad as we all feared? Someone please give me a hint.

From what I've seen so far, which admittedly isn't a heck of a lot, it looks a lot like the same old stuff with new numbering, and slight changes to costumes and origins, which is more or less what I expected. Haven't seen the "new" Superman yet or the "new" Wonder Woman, but the "new" Batman is just Batman as he was the month prior to the re-whatever. Supposedly all the history of Batman and Green Lantern is more or less intact while just about everyone else's history is changed. (more on that in a moment).

I've heard all the stuff about how new readers hate all the baggage of continuity and frankly I think that's a load of horse manure. Readers don't hate that, writers do, because they can't think of a way to tell their story in continuity, it's so much easier just to chuck whatever is inconvenient. But the trap DC will fall into is the same one they fell into after COIE, that being that eventually some writer is going to get nostalgic for some aspect of the old DCU which has been left out of the DCnU and bring it back, just like they did with the spectrum of kryptonite colors, and Supergirl, and Krypto, and Superboy, and the Arctic fortress, and the less sterile version of Krypton, and Wonder Woman being a founding member of the JLA and so much more! Another problem is that while Batman's and Green Lantern's history haven't altered much, everyone around them has had their history changed, but that creates as big a problem as it solves because now a lot of the stories which are "in the new continuity" couldn't have happened as we read them because other characters who have changed interacted with Batman and GL, but their history has changed...so how could they have taken part in the Batman or GL story,. (sort of like when Black Canary was retconned into the origin of the JLA to replace WW.) That's not only an editorial problem, it's pretty confusing trying to figure out what did and didn't happen and in which story it did or didn't occur in the new history. I guess if I were younger, I might just go with it, but I find I don't have the patience for this sort of stuff that I used to have.

So really bunging up continuity creates about as many problems as it solves. Maybe a clean slate DCU would have been better, it they were intent upon doing this re-whatever it is.

[custodes]

I read a dozen or so and I have about 24 right now. I liked Action best and Superboy was good. Never read Resurrection Man before but, it was good. Flew through them all. Batgirl was pretty good but, didn't like her "mental problems." JLA was pretty good for a marathon. But, liked it. JLI was a bit weak. Batwing, I liked. African Super Hero with ties to Batman Incorporated. Good art and violence. Swamp Thing OK. Animal Man OK (although, like Resurrection Man never read any of these so don't know what it should be.)

Still have half of them unread. The only ones I really think are "the possibility of special" so far are JLA and Action. Maybe Superboy. Truthfully I'm not use to reading single comics so am not sure. There is a good chance I will drop them all.

Haven't read Detective and Batman and Robin yet.

[jordanscott]

I haven't really embraced new DC yet.

But then, my pull list is limited.

The Lantern related titles which aren't being dicked around with that much except Sinestro. And then Suicide Squad, the Legion titles and Deathstroke. SS gets monkeyed around with on a regular basis so this reshuffling is not actually a big impact and I like Harley Quinn. Not keen on King Shark, but I'll roll with it for a bit. The Legion gets dicked around with so much, again, this new DCU is not really a big thing to them and their 'continuity'. And Deathstroke...unless the new DCU has him being Dick Grayson's father now, there's not a lot of him they can mess up. He's a bad guy/anti-hero I've always liked and i think it's cool for him to get his own title (flashpoint stuff not withstanding).

For the most part, I, and my LCS owner and most of the DC fans I know, think that 95% of these titles aren't going to see month 13.

[Jabby J]

I was kind of bummed to miss out on Batgirl and Detective Comics...

[custodes]

Well, Detective was one of the better new 52. The cover says Batman Detective Comics. Inside 2nd and 3rd page- 2 page spread says Batman In Detective Comics. The indicia, on the last page (of the book not the story), just reads Detective. Usually the indicia is the "real" title info. Hmm? Changing characters someday?

It took 7 minutes to read. That is longer than most. It is a Batman/Joker serial killer feel story. It seems like the book will have a gruesome/murder/ultra violence theme. The Mayor is getting the force after Bats. So he is fighting the cops too. Some of whom are firing rounds at him, shoot to kill. The Commish is one the right side.

[custodes]

Green Lantern was good but, it only took 4 minutes to read. $.75 a minute. Rather than the 3.99 issues which are $1.00 a minute.

He has lost his job and ring and asks Carol for help. Sinestro has his Ring and doesn't want it. What did he do?

[comicmanshipper]

much better then i thought they would be
and a real shot in the arm for the comics biz

no real misses though i have not read Hawk and Dove yet
from what i read
in ranking order:
Animal Man (if you like the 80's/90's series , this has the same flavour)
Detective ( great cliffhanger-hard to believe this is the same guy that use to do that Image stuff)
Action (i am a sucker for Superman , in his early days type of material)
JLA ( love 1st meetings between heroes)
Batwing (really like the art and the character -though i needed a 2nd read to make sure i had the flow of the story right ( i did)
Batgirl (always like Bab's in the costume)
Stormwatch ( excellent art , and nice to see the Wildstorm characters in the DCU)
Green Arrow (this is a real re-boot , resembles the Smallville GA , a bit)
Static (and though this ranks last on what I've read so far in the DC reboot era , it is heads and shoulders above 95% of the Marvel titles i read last week , a fun read)

so far so good , all above average

it is nice to be excited for Wens. again , i feel like a kid

[comicmanshipper]

[QUOTE=custodes;90551]Green Lantern was good but, it only took 4 minutes to read. $.75 a minute. QUOTE]

i really make a point of really taking my time , and really taking in the artwork of the comic ( i use to rush through reading them, but for $3+ i take my time.

The "Where's Waldo" aspect in the reboots , usually has me re-reading the comic for a 2nd time , right after i finish the comic the 1st time.

I also tend to re-read the previous issue before the new issue , reading so many titles each month , its hard to remember each plot point in every title

So my plan with the reboots is a mininum of 3 read thrus
Reading comics is still my favorite leisure type of thing to do.
Followed by listening to music , and watching MLB/NFL/Boxing/Nascar/Indy

[comicmanshipper]

one of the odd things with this , is that 2 shops i sometimes deal with are doing midnight openings for the month
from what i have been told they have been packed the 1st 3 weeks

one of the shops is in a strip mall that has to stay open until 10 anyway
so i guess 2 hours is no big deal
and the other usually puts out the new books after closing on Tuesday
so they are ready to go the next morning
the funny thing was, this shop never planned a midnight opening
but the 1st week they noticed people gathering at the front door at 11:30
and before they knew it they had 200+ people in at Midnight

anything that causes excitement like this is good for the funny book biz
it has been a long time since the comic industry has had excitement like this

one shop owner told me the Obama Spidey comic was a big deal , but that was just one book , this is multiple comics

the same shop owner told me that is the biggest gross $$$ weeks on new comics , his store has seen since Knightfall

[custodes]

I have never before read Stormwatch (never even heard of it) so it was fresh and exciting for me. Same thing with Frankie of SHADE thingee. Do not know how they hold up to previous books of theirs but, enjoyed both #1s very much.

OMAC was OK. Grifter too. First time reading these characters as well.

Enjoyed Batman and Robin #1 a lot. I might keep reading this book as well as Detective and Action and JLA and Stormwatch and Shade. Robin/Damon is really starting to get on my nerves though. Damn 10 year old brat thinks he knows everything. He needs a bitchslapping.

On a non-52 note, I just finished Flashpoint:Batman Knight of Vengeance. All three issues and was very impressed. Here is a small, recent run series, though not entirely relevant to the new books (but, who knows) was really a kickass story. And I'm not much of a Batman fan.

Liked Legion Lost. The art, while OK, is not my kind of storytelling art. Has potential. Being a huge Legion fan I'm eagerly awaiting the regular Legion book, fingers crossed.

[comicmanshipper]

so far , so good , probably the most enjoyable line of mainstream comics , i have read in long time, i know only 1 issue in , but this had all of the potential to be a huge bomb. that the books are for the most part good reads , has me happy and looking forward to tomorrow.
rank of what i read the last few days:
1. Swamp Thing , seems to be going for the best of both prime eras with a new twist
2. Superboy , the real surprise , love the new take on the whole clone thing
3. Men Of War , almost like a mix of Sgt Rock and Astro City , another surprise
4. B&R , the kid seems like more of a "ass" then ever , loved the whole "Crime Alley" thing
5. Suicide Squad , Secret Six fans will dig this
6. Resurrection Man , a more Vertigo type update , good revival
7. OMAC , for anybody that likes the Kirby title and Kirby's Olsen run , huge wild concepts
8. Mister Terrific , feel bad ranking this so low , cause this was really good , great and unexpected cliffhanger
9. JLI , by no means not entertaining , kind of an upate on the whole late 80's JL

truthfully 1 thru 9 could rank in a different order tomorrow , they were all above average to very good

10. Hawk and Dove , the concept is decent , and i usually like Gates. Liefeld is what is expected , and he has his fans , and he actually fits the title well, this just needed more story content , this title ranks about the equal of an above average current Marvel Title ( Moon Knight , etc), i'll still give this a few issues to find its way

[custodes]

Just finished Men of War #1 and I agree with comicmanshipper. An excellent book. Rocks' grandson, in the ashtray, kicking ass and winning hearts and minds.

As it is in the DC Universe Metas exist but, are in the background. They can effect the world but, are not major characters to the book. If it continues this way, war book with faceless accidents of nature, on both sides like Marvels in the sky, if will be a winner. Used very sparingly, one hopes. Nameless.

Second backup story, about a groups of US SEALs, 3-parter, was pretty good too. The format felt like a DC Silver Age book.

[comicmanshipper]

read 3 more today , needed a break from unbagging another collection and play checking records , gave my helpers the go ahead do things without me for a couple of hours hope that was not a mistake
1-GL (i like the twist of Sinestro in the lead)
2-RL (really expected to hate this , but was surprised this held my interest , not really a fan of the whole concept , just a very good 1st issue , with enough here for anyone who never read an appearance before , and enough new for anybody familiar with the characters)
3-Legion Lost (probably my most disappointing relauch title , just not enough story and a new reader would be totally lost , no background on any of the leads , hopefully this picks up with #2 , right now this and H&D are my misses from the relaunch)

[pasnat54]

Yep. I'm a new reader to the Legion and I was lost. I recognized the non-human characters, but wasn't sure what their powers were. I have only read the Legion casually in the past few decades, so I didn't know who they were chasing through time or why, and was not intrigued enough to put #2 on my list.

I may wait for the books to show up at the bi-weekly collectibles show for $1 each. I always liked the Legion and I suppose I keep tabs on it hoping it'll someday reach the Great Darkness heights again.

[custodes]

Well, I liked these, a lot, this week.

Batman
Nightwing
Catwoman
Legion of Super Heroes
Birds of Prey

OK were
Supergirl
Captain Atom
Wonder Woman
Deadman

I forgot to pick up Blue Bettle somehow.#banghead# Was looking forward to it.



#rockon#Red Hood and The Outlaws was my favorite.#rockon#

[nocutename]

I wanted Blue Beetle too but they were sold out. I got WW and it was OK. Interested enough to try the next couple of issues. I also got Demon Knights but wasn't too keen on it. I am just a sucker for Etrigan that I will most likely get the next issue.

[fastballspecial]

So before I review any here is what has sold out in the 3 shops in my area. Overall 52 has been a smashing sucess for DC. Alot of books are well written with very good or decent art. Personally I liked Batman, Detective, Batgirl, Catwoman, and Green Arrow the most. Justice League and Red Hood both so promise. Unlike many others the art in Animal man was too pathetic for me to even read the book well. WonderWoman for the same reason I just wont sit and ready a $4 book with crap art. I liked Suicide Squad and Nightwing, but I think they need more issues under their belt to tell.

Sold Out
Catwoman
Bat-Girl
Batman
Detective
Green Lantern (I think there a variant or two left white)
Animal Man(Had one copy left last time I looked)
Red Hood(Had 2 copies left out of 3 stores)

Whats not selling
Wonderwoman
BatWing
Resurrection Man(no suprise there)
Men of War(Not surprised very old title)
Blue Beetle ( See above.)

[nocutename]

Around me, the only thing I found was 1 copy of Wonder Woman and the store had a few Demon Knights left. I looked around for someone over on the CGC and B&N had a few 1s left. They probably didn't get the whole run but I recall seeing Nightwing and Batwoman on the shelf. Finally, the shop owner who closed his store earily this year, is now renting space in a gaming store. He had some 1's left - Catwoman, Resurrection Man, Demon Knights and Batwing. There probably was a few others but I cannot remember which ones. On the flip side, he never advertised opening nor is it really known that there is a shop there. So the fact that he sold out of any comics is an amazing feat.

WW isn't $4.00. I think the only $4 comic is Justice League. The art in WW wasn't crappy at all, IMO. I thought the panel layout was fantastic and moved the story nicely. I love Diana's new outfit and thought they really made her very pretty. Personally, I was looking for Blue Beetle. I love the character and the first series was great.

I am limiting myself to only a few books. What I am getting is Demon Knight, Justice League Dark and Wonder Woman (since I found a copy.) Batgirl second print comes out next week and I may be stupid enough to get it. I trying to stay out of Gotham City reads right now.

[fastballspecial]

Around me, the only thing I found was 1 copy of Wonder Woman and the store had a few Demon Knights left. I looked around for someone over on the CGC and B&N had a few 1s left. They probably didn't get the whole run but I recall seeing Nightwing and Batwoman on the shelf. Finally, the shop owner who closed his store earily this year, is now renting space in a gaming store. He had some 1's left - Catwoman, Resurrection Man, Demon Knights and Batwing. There probably was a few others but I cannot remember which ones. On the flip side, he never advertised opening nor is it really known that there is a shop there. So the fact that he sold out of any comics is an amazing feat.

WW isn't $4.00. I think the only $4 comic is Justice League. The art in WW wasn't crappy at all, IMO. I thought the panel layout was fantastic and moved the story nicely. I love Diana's new outfit and thought they really made her very pretty. Personally, I was looking for Blue Beetle. I love the character and the first series was great.

I am limiting myself to only a few books. What I am getting is Demon Knight, Justice League Dark and Wonder Woman (since I found a copy.) Batgirl second print comes out next week and I may be stupid enough to get it. I trying to stay out of Gotham City reads right now.


Its just a difference of artistic taste. Wonder Woman too me looks cartoonish and half assed. It might that I dont like Brian A either after that crap he wrote in Superman a few years ago. I think Wonder Woman would work great as a Vertigo title because the writing has that feel and art is well Vertigo style. Just saying it wont go over well with Super Hero fans like me. I could be wrong and you are more the free to tell me about it if I am, but I dont see this book becoming even a top 50 book.

I really enjoyed both Catwoman and Bat-Girl and they were both written very differently. Interested to see where Suicide Squad goes too because I like Harly and Dead Shot.

[pasnat54]

Well, I don't like the characterization of Starfire in The Red Hood, and I'm just too far behind on the Green Lantern Mythos to get interested in what's going on now.

I'd like to find a copy of Demon Knights, and if Our Army At War were $3 instead of $4, I'd buy it. Wonder why a few titles are selling for $4?
One store in Pasadena that I only visit when I need ink for my printer (there's a recycled ink cartridge store next door) is selling Justice League for $10.

I only bought a couple of #1's, and I'd say the ones I might continue reading are the Legion books and Resurrection Man. Strangely, R-Man intrigued me a bit. I had never heard of him before, and the art had a nostalgic sense to me. Sort of like Rich Buckler inked by Tom Palmer, which yields a very Neal Adams-ish result.

[nocutename]

I just lost my post!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Arrg that stupid button.

Reboot or not, WW isn't a top book. I am just hoping it does well. I loved Superman For Tomorrow, so are taste are very different. Azzarello character vision strays from the norm. It gives his books like Batman an elseworlds read but I still like his writing style.

[nocutename]

Resurrection Man had a series in the 90's. I read a handful of issues and it was pretty good. I didn't realize there were other $4 books. I am guess it has to do with page counts. Demon Knights was intrigue as a set up issue. A lot is going on so there isn't a really story yet. Which didn't make me happy. I think this will be a good book to read collectively. I just want to purchase the single issues. One LCS by me still has copies of DK. I will pick it up for you if you want to pay for it plus shipping.


Well, I don't like the characterization of Starfire in The Red Hood, and I'm just too far behind on the Green Lantern Mythos to get interested in what's going on now.

I'd like to find a copy of Demon Knights, and if Our Army At War were $3 instead of $4, I'd buy it. Wonder why a few titles are selling for $4?
One store in Pasadena that I only visit when I need ink for my printer (there's a recycled ink cartridge store next door) is selling Justice League for $10.

I only bought a couple of #1's, and I'd say the ones I might continue reading are the Legion books and Resurrection Man. Strangely, R-Man intrigued me a bit. I had never heard of him before, and the art had a nostalgic sense to me. Sort of like Rich Buckler inked by Tom Palmer, which yields a very Neal Adams-ish result.

[custodes]

Superman was very good. Teen Titans was very good too. Two of the best.

[nocutename]

Two more issues: Blue Beetle - Not too impressed with the issue but I am letting it slide as it was more or less a set up issue. I will be getting the next one to see how it rolls. If you read the previous volume it was very humorus and light. This doesn't seem it is going to hit that same stride.

Justice League Dark - Loved this book. Out of the 4 new reboot books this one was my favorite. I am really looking forward to continuing this story.

[comicmanshipper]

finally read some more , has been so busy
9 new titles read: top 6 good or better , 1 so-so , 2 misses but i'll give them more issues
1-Frankenstein (big , crazy concepts -though not Kirby related so far , this is a definite nod to the early 70's Kirby anything goes ideas)
2-Demon Knights ( Camelot 3000 meets Kirby )
3-DeathStroke ( man , Bennett really has a Kirby inspired influence , this was a real surprise , great last 4 pages )
4-Batwoman ( nice job of catching a new reader up and something new for the long time reader , best looking book being published)
5-WW (excellent story , easy to follow , and many interesting sub-plots , i know some wil hate the art , but it works very well in the context of the story being told)
6-Nightwing (solid , not missing a beat , reads like your catching up with long time frined )

1 to 6 could be any order
7-Legion (step up from the other title , and good use of the character intros for new readers , maybe threw too much out there in a 1st issue , still excellent art , a title to watch)

8- Grifter (another title that threw too much out there in the 1st issue )
9- Red Hood ( whew! maybe the worst title in the relaunch , decent art , Starfire though , hopefully they can fix the changes to the character)

[custodes]

Two more issues: Blue Beetle - Not too impressed with the issue but I am letting it slide as it was more or less a set up issue. I will be getting the next one to see how it rolls. If you read the previous volume it was very humorus and light. This doesn't seem it is going to hit that same stride.

Justice League Dark - Loved this book. Out of the 4 new reboot books this one was my favorite. I am really looking forward to continuing this story.

It was confusing. I didn't need another origin and the last book was really good.I'll give it a chance though.

[nocutename]

It was confusing. I didn't need another origin and the last book was really good.I'll give it a chance though.

I thought it was me with BB. I am going to check out the next issue though.

[custodes]

Just read New Avengers 16.1 and it was very interesting. Neal Adams /Tom Palmer did the entire inside art. And it was excellent. Do not know the story behind this yet. Hope there is more. Like a run!

[comicmanshipper]

Wish i had more time , but finally made some time to read another batch

some really solid stuff in this batch
topped by
Batman #1 (all the things you would want in a Batman comic)
DCU Deadman (you would have to go back to SA to find a as good Deadman)
GLC ( good job in capturing some personal moments in John and Guy's life)
Blue Beetle ( real strong issue for someone who only knows the character from the TV show , though i agree on the pacing , a 2nd read thru , read a lot better)
BOP (like it enough , and unique enough that is not just a retread of the previous titles)
Supergirl ( has a lot of potential , this issue while good , was all setup)
Catwoman ( love this (actually in an ASB&R way) , a fun over the top spectacle-probably like this more then i should , for how annoyed some people were with issue , my local stores are telling me though , this is a top 5 or 6 seller for the relaunch )


Captain Atom ( was the one i was most disappointed in , the story and art were just meh, again a lot of set up , so hopefully this goes somewhere , and I usually like Freddie's art , but he seems to be trying something with the title , amybe this will come together in the next 2-3 issues )

[pasnat54]

I just read JLA Dark and was surprised to find I really liked it. It had a little touch of Neil Gaiman goofiness, "I just bought the air Roger Maris' 61st home run cut through!") but it featured Zatanna and Madame Xanadu, two magical characters I've always felt had more potential than DC ever tapped.

Did someone mention Neal Adams? Inked by Tom Palmer? Now my interest is piqued. I just may have to take a copy out of the bag at my LCS and read it while standing in the aisle.

[custodes]

I just read JLA Dark and was surprised to find I really liked it. It had a little touch of Neil Gaiman goofiness, "I just bought the air Roger Maris' 61st home run cut through!") but it featured Zatanna and Madame Xanadu, two magical characters I've always felt had more potential than DC ever tapped.

Did someone mention Neal Adams? Inked by Tom Palmer? Now my interest is piqued. I just may have to take a copy out of the bag at my LCS and read it while standing in the aisle.

Shoot. I missed this JLA Dark book. So many come out every week they can get lost. 8 weeks of trying new individual books.:oops: I agree about the 2 ladies.

The New Avengers 16.1 ( the Point One Initiative...good starting places they say...whatev) Bendis/ Adams/Palmer.....very good Art inside and on cover. Whole issue. I think it is a one shot. 12 issue ark would have been nice. Came out last week. Should be able to find it. Hearing nothing about it. Slipped by?

[nocutename]

I just read JLA Dark and was surprised to find I really liked it. It had a little touch of Neil Gaiman goofiness, "I just bought the air Roger Maris' 61st home run cut through!") but it featured Zatanna and Madame Xanadu, two magical characters I've always felt had more potential than DC ever tapped.

Did someone mention Neal Adams? Inked by Tom Palmer? Now my interest is piqued. I just may have to take a copy out of the bag at my LCS and read it while standing in the aisle.

Justice League Dark was my favorite book out of the 4 I got.

[custodes]

Justice League Dark was my favorite book out of the 4 I got.

I just read it and liked it. I missed it last week, The cover didn't catch my eye. I guess I thought it was some other mini-series instead of a 52 book. The logo and characters didn't jump out when I just glanced at it. It seemed a " short stoy book" at first glance or anthology until I looked at it carefully. Good read wish it was longer.

[jaydeebee]

All in all I ended up buying 35 of the 52 titles which reset to #1 in September, which is about two more DC's than I would buy normally. Here are some thoughts on what I bought,...

Action Comics - I don't care for Grant Morrison, I can tolerate him however and Superman has always been my favorite comics character and that isn't likely to change. My take on the issue, I thought the jeans and T-shirt costume was stupid with a capital "S", I think that it, more than any of the changes, diminishes the Man of Steel and makes him look very silly, running around with a blanket tucked in his collar. The story otherwise isn't bad, the return to a more outlaw Superman doesn't bother me, but I doubt it will last long. I absolutely HATE that the historic numbering has been removed from the book. Conclusion: I will continue to buy this title.

Superman - I really liked the art on this book, I think the new Superman armor uniform is hideous. Aside from that, the writing was good, the story while obviously part of a larger arc, read as a single issue and was chocked full of dialogue. Overall good, I don't really mind the Clark/Lois marriage going away and I'm glad that Superman's secret ID is a secret again, but something still feels off about the way the characters interact with each other. I absolutely HATE that the historic numbering has been removed from the book.
Conclusion: I will continue to buy this title.

Superboy - I was rather fond of the Superboy series just prior to the reboot, it took me the better part of a decade or more to really like Conner Kent and Superboy. I liked that he had become more or less a sibling of Clark Kent being raised by Ma in Smallville. It was a nice way of having something akin to the classic Superboy, but set in the present day. Unfortunately DC chucked all of that for something completely unlike the previous series. I can't say I'm crazy about it, the art was fine, but the cover was butt ugly. The story was confusing and jumped about too much. I think this series unnecessarily took Superboy back to his lab roots, and I really wish they hadn't done that.
Conclusion: I will most likely stick with this book through at least the first story arc.

Supergirl - I'm not going to mince words here. I HATE THIS VERSION OF SUPERGIRL. I don't like anything about this book. The art is poor, the new costume is beyond ridiculous looking, with a backwards "Z" for the "S" symbol, a high collar cape, a pair of very unlikely looking boots and a red crotch shield to draw your attention to her area. The Supergirl being presented here has just arrived on Earth, has no idea where she is and is angry and very alien acting. This may be more "realistic", but it isn't particularly compelling.
Conclusion: I will most likely drop this title like a hot rock.

Teen Titans - Sigh...what can I say about a book in which the writers have chosen to throw away everything and start over?
I really became aware of the Teen Titans in 1980 when THE NEW TEEN TITANS arrived on the scene, I loved that book, the characters and the art, the writing was top-notch as well.
I can't really say that about this nu Teen Titans.
The NEW TEEN TITANS became the hottest book of it's time and remains very popular even today.
This nu Teen Titans book, probably will not do that.
Last month I spent $12.49 (after discount) for THE NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES HC Graphic Novel ($24.99 cover price) and $2.69 (after discount) for nu Teen Titans #1. The HC Graphic Novel was a better deal...
Conclusion: I'm toying with the idea of dropping this title.

Wonder Woman - This title was better than I expected, although I'm still a fan of the classic costume, I can live with the current one, anything is better than that laughably bad montrosity that Jim Lee saddled her with during "The Odyssey" storyline. The art in this book was a bit darker than I expect from a WW comic, but the story seems to fit the character, at least as she has been presented in recent years. I can deal with it and hope for better in the future. As before, I absolutely HATE that the historic numbering has been removed from the book.
Conclusion: I will continue to buy this title, at least for the foreseeable future.

Voodoo - I had no intention of buying this book when it was first announced, but I saw it on the shelf at my LCS and there was one copy, the art looked nice and I'm a sucker for nice art, so I bought it. The book isn't bad, but it really isn't my cup of tea either. The main character murders a man in the first issue, which to me is a turn-off. I can't really say I'm stoked about buying the next issue, good art not withstanding.
Conclusion: I'm dropping this book.

There are other books that I bought that I want to talk about, but I'll post them at another time,...

[comicmanshipper]

All in all I ended up buying 35 of the 52 titles which reset to #1 in September, which is about two more DC's than I would buy normally. Here are some thoughts on what I bought,...

Action Comics - I don't care for Grant Morrison, I can tolerate him however and Superman has always been my favorite comics character and that isn't likely to change. My take on the issue, I thought the jeans and T-shirt costume was stupid with a capital "S", I think that it, more than any of the changes, diminishes the Man of Steel and makes him look very silly, running around with a blanket tucked in his collar. The story otherwise isn't bad, the return to a more outlaw Superman doesn't bother me, but I doubt it will last long. I absolutely HATE that the historic numbering has been removed from the book. Conclusion: I will continue to buy this title.

Superman - I really liked the art on this book, I think the new Superman armor uniform is hideous. Aside from that, the writing was good, the story while obviously part of a larger arc, read as a single issue and was chocked full of dialogue. Overall good, I don't really mind the Clark/Lois marriage going away and I'm glad that Superman's secret ID is a secret again, but something still feels off about the way the characters interact with each other. I absolutely HATE that the historic numbering has been removed from the book.
Conclusion: I will continue to buy this title.

Superboy - I was rather fond of the Superboy series just prior to the reboot, it took me the better part of a decade or more to really like Conner Kent and Superboy. I liked that he had become more or less a sibling of Clark Kent being raised by Ma in Smallville. It was a nice way of having something akin to the classic Superboy, but set in the present day. Unfortunately DC chucked all of that for something completely unlike the previous series. I can't say I'm crazy about it, the art was fine, but the cover was butt ugly. The story was confusing and jumped about too much. I think this series unnecessarily took Superboy back to his lab roots, and I really wish they hadn't done that.
Conclusion: I will most likely stick with this book through at least the first story arc.

Supergirl - I'm not going to mince words here. I HATE THIS VERSION OF SUPERGIRL. I don't like anything about this book. The art is poor, the new costume is beyond ridiculous looking, with a backwards "Z" for the "S" symbol, a high collar cape, a pair of very unlikely looking boots and a red crotch shield to draw your attention to her area. The Supergirl being presented here has just arrived on Earth, has no idea where she is and is angry and very alien acting. This may be more "realistic", but it isn't particularly compelling.
Conclusion: I will most likely drop this title like a hot rock.

Teen Titans - Sigh...what can I say about a book in which the writers have chosen to throw away everything and start over?
I really became aware of the Teen Titans in 1980 when THE NEW TEEN TITANS arrived on the scene, I loved that book, the characters and the art, the writing was top-notch as well.
I can't really say that about this nu Teen Titans.
The NEW TEEN TITANS became the hottest book of it's time and remains very popular even today.
This nu Teen Titans book, probably will not do that.
Last month I spent $12.49 (after discount) for THE NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES HC Graphic Novel ($24.99 cover price) and $2.69 (after discount) for nu Teen Titans #1. The HC Graphic Novel was a better deal...
Conclusion: I'm toying with the idea of dropping this title.

Wonder Woman - This title was better than I expected, although I'm still a fan of the classic costume, I can live with the current one, anything is better than that laughably bad montrosity that Jim Lee saddled her with during "The Odyssey" storyline. The art in this book was a bit darker than I expect from a WW comic, but the story seems to fit the character, at least as she has been presented in recent years. I can deal with it and hope for better in the future. As before, I absolutely HATE that the historic numbering has been removed from the book.
Conclusion: I will continue to buy this title, at least for the foreseeable future.

Voodoo - I had no intention of buying this book when it was first announced, but I saw it on the shelf at my LCS and there was one copy, the art looked nice and I'm a sucker for nice art, so I bought it. The book isn't bad, but it really isn't my cup of tea either. The main character murders a man in the first issue, which to me is a turn-off. I can't really say I'm stoked about buying the next issue, good art not withstanding.
Conclusion: I'm dropping this book.

There are other books that I bought that I want to talk about, but I'll post them at another time,...

Glad you found the thread , i almost missed it in the beginning because of the thread title

anyway read 3 more when i had some time
all 3 very very good
(truthfully , it seems like many creators stepped up their game with this relaunch, by far and away this was the most consistent DC month i can remember)

Aquaman (really surprised by the direction , not at all what i expected , but like the "Batman" comic pretty much , this hits the ground running and has enough of the old "Aquaman" mixed with a new direction , excellent art)

All-Star Western ( really really great approach to the character and the new DCU , really like how this ties into "the history of this new DCU" and yet keeps the Hex flavor from the previous series , i read somehere the late 80's/early 90's Truman Hex series' was what used for the film inspiration. The absolute worse Hex comic series used as the film basis , it figures. Its too bad that film probably killed any chance of a film reboot , this 1st issue would have been a great point to launch a film reboot or sequel , the comic was that good)

Voodoo (like jay , i really really liked the art , but i liked the story and even the twist , i kind of like the twist of the lead being a "villain" or maybe she's not a "villain" , anyway the twist still really shocked me when it came , and based on the 1st few pages was not what i expected, again a strong like from me , ++ the backstage dancer banter read fairly true , my next door neighbor is a dancer , and she thought the dialogue rang pretty true also , so good job in that regard)

[custodes]

Shoot, I missed this Voodoo book. I read about 47 of the 52. Might stick with 10 or so. Don't know. Monthly books are hard for me. So small,so quick and my memory is not up to it. ;-)

I might stick with the Superman books and Legion and JLA. Strange reading

Men of War issue #2. Not sure if supers/metas should be so prevalent. Liked issue 1 better. Will see. Teen Titans was good (besides the do-over thingee.) Some Batbooks maybe.

[comicmanshipper]

had time for 2 more
Blackhawk was mostly good (nice job of introducing the characters, maybe just a bit too much thrown in for a 1st issue , has potential , combines the BH mythos with a 80's GI Joe spin ( the Russian Irishman could be a breakout character)

Dark Knight (out of the 4 Bat books , this was my least favorite - the 2 minuses for me , we already had an Arkham breakout attempt (done better) this month (i know the 2 stories take place in a slightly different timespan , still a bad idea too have 2 different attempts in the same month) , also the Two-Face twist was hokey) , not a horrible book , but the other 3 Batman books set the bar high

[custodes]

had time for 2 more
Blackhawk was mostly good (nice job of introducing the characters, maybe just a bit too much thrown in for a 1st issue , has potential , combines the BH mythos with a 80's GI Joe spin ( the Russian Irishman could be a breakout character)

Dark Knight (out of the 4 Bat books , this was my least favorite - the 2 minuses for me , we already had an Arkham breakout attempt (done better) this month (i know the 2 stories take place in a slightly different timespan , still a bad idea too have 2 different attempts in the same month) , also the Two-Face twist was hokey) , not a horrible book , but the other 3 Batman books set the bar high

I know this is "so over" but, the Flashpoint Batbooks were really good. 1-3 with Bruce dying in the crime alley instead of the 'rents and his dad taking the cape!

And the Joker.

If you are a Batfan. Recommend.

[comicmanshipper]

finally the home stretch

3 more all good , 2 of them pretty close to excellent
Titans (one of the titles i was looking forward to the least , really surprised , how much i liked the book , made me feel like i did when i was a kid , Titans was one of my favorite books from the 60's to early 80's , and Booth's art , when did these 90's Image guys get good , Tony Daniel and Booth really surprised me , raising their game to a new level)

Flash ( love the art , and fast paced , good storytelling ,feels a bit more like Wally West era Flash then a Barry Allen Flash , still a very good read)

Firestorm ( liked this a lot about 80% thru , the last 4-5 pages though just seemed a bit rushed (and a bit hokey) , but some good creators working here , so i have faith

[Evil Parsnip]

Ok, after reading this topic that I started for so long I finally decided that I'd better break down and read the books myself. Gotten through about half of them and on the whole I'm unsure.

So far.

I liked Justice League. It certainly has some potential and it is nice to see this concept turned a bit on it's ear with a new beginning. They'll have to deftly web the threads together to make Batman seem like he'll belong with this group. Think it could be easy to drop the ball here.

Action. Interesting. not sure I love it. But don't think it's dreadful so far. I'd give it a few more issues.

Animal Man - pretty true to the 1988 version of animal man #1 with a nice little twist at the end.

The miscellaneous bat books. Batgirl was decent, Batwing has potential, Batwoman gets a thumbs down, Detective has a decent feel to it. Batman and Robin - Hate the kid, like the direction the book seems to be heading, but removing the darkness from the Knight could be a tricky thing. Batwoman - didn't care much for her in the last few issues in the old Detective, not sure I like her now, but I'd give it more time.

Green Arrow. has the same flaw as so many of the other titles this month. Too bloody many multimillionaire-billionaires running around the DC universe with foundations, and devoting their lives to bettering the human condition while running around in tights on the side. Still fairly true to the Oliver Queen we all know, but maybe a bit less interesting.

Hawk and Dove, wasn't expecting much, delivered a lot of depth and interesting characters. Art was ok.

JLI - Meh.

Men of War - Maybe the best of what I've read so far. Be nice to see what they make of this series.

OMAC - not good enough to justify a second issue.

Static Shock - really? Not a fan.

Stormwatch. Never read the series before, like the concept, good first issue.

Deathstroke. A pleasant surprise. Kind of liked it.

Demon Knights. Fair to middling. Lots of potential here. Love the meetings of the immortals and semi immortals.

Frankenstein. Think I can pass on this one.

Green Lantern. Like the Sinestro angle. Liked the book. Hope the quality stays

Grifter. Very not impressed.

Legion Lost. Not very impressed.

Mister Terrific - Not a character I knew from my regular readings, but I did kind of like it. Will give it a few more issues.

Red Lanterns. Ok, not sure about it, but I didn't read the various colored lantern stories so I don't know what to think yet.

Reserrection Man. Liked it a fair bit. Seemed very much online with Preacher. if they can do it that well it will be good.

Suicide Squad. Same old, same old. That's not a bad thing.

Superboy, liked it.

I probably could review these more in depth but I read a few too many in a row so judging them all is tough. I'll try to get to the rest in the next few days.

[jaydeebee]

Aquaman #1 - Good stuff. Fantastic art and satisfying story. I've always liked Aquaman, but he very often hasn't been handled well (especially during that whole "Sword of Atlantis" deal). I like what I'm seeing with this title, I hope it continues. Interestingly, his and Mera's marriage seems to be the only union which has survived the reboot.

Conclusion: I will continue buying this one and I encourage others to give it a look-see!

O.M.A.C. #1 - I'm flabbergasted! I actually enjoyed this and have already bought the second issue! Giffen's art while not for everyone, seems to match the feel of this book, Didio's writing (God help me!) is actually okay! It pays homage to the Kirby classic without the ponderous melodrama.

Conclusion: Eye...er, I mean I will continue to buy this.

[Evil Parsnip]

Finished my reading thought I'd share my impressions on the rest of the books.

Batman - Good, but hey I've always been partial to the bat.

Birds of Prey - They have the heart and soul of a good idea here, but the execution in terms of storytelling seems unnecessarily convoluted and somewhat predictable. I'll give it a chance.

Blue Beetle - wow, the more I read of this the more i miss Ted Cord.

Captain Atom - average to good, seems like a tired storyline without any hint of explanation.

Catwoman - very different. All in all an interesting story.

DC Universe Presents with Deadman. Always liked the character from back in the day, but not sure I like this version. Would give it a chance as the story arc has potential.

GL Corps - Solid book storywise. Can't say I love the art.

GL the New Guardians - Really liked this book. Good story, decent art.

Legion of Superheroes - Never one of my favorite books. Won't bother reading more, but I'd bet the lack of time travel doesn't last a year.

Nightwing - Excellent character development. Liked the book a lot.

Red hood and the Outlaws - liked it. I'll disagree with the whole starfire dislike thing. It's a total role reversal of the innocent princess that she used to be. The reboot makes her morally and differently alien, not the overly empathic being who we grew up with in previous Titans incarnations. While it does make her a flatter character in some ways (ie I can't see how she could one day hope to rule an empire), it makes her richer in some ways because she is SO different from most of the other DC female characters.

Supergirl - didn't hate it, thought it average and telling a story we've seen many times before.

Wonder Woman - One of the best of the relaunch.

All Star Western. Nice first issue. Hope they can keep this quality story going.

Aquaman - Maybe the best of the relaunch. Really thought this was an excellent book and taking the character in a new direction is what really needs to happen here.

Dark Knight - liked it a bunch. The Wrightson-esque two face at the end had me rechecking who the artist was - as it seemed better than a lot of the rest of the issue.

Blackhawks - good updating of the concept, looks like it has potential. Better than I expected.

Flash - I know I'm in the minority but I really liked Wally West - I agree this seemed like one of his stories. A good first book.

Fury of Firestorm - I'd give this a thumbs down for exactly the reason that comicman mentioned above. It was going so well until the last 5 or so pages when it dissolved into a chaotic, poorly laid out and illustrated mess. Its a character I used to like so seeing the ending here was a real letdown.

I vampire - another vampire story? I guess I understand the popularity. First issue was well done.

Justice League Dark - Liked it a lot, A nice surprise, but they could ruin the Constantine character if they make him more than a bit player and that would be real shame as he's one of my favorites in the DC universe.

Savage Hawkman - I was really surprised that I liked this book Hawkman has always been one of my least favorite characters in the entire DC universe but I liked the story, I liked the art, I'd buy it again.

Superman - average at best.

Teen Titans - A really pleasant reboot. I can see this being a great book if the writing and art continue in this vein.

Voodoo - ok, I don't get it. Unless this is a very limited series I have no idea where this is going or why it's going there.

[custodes]

I haven't read Flash yet but, I see you both really like Teen Titans, like me.

Liked Red Hood as well!

[comicmanshipper]

finally wrapped up the #1's
now on to the #2's and misc

on a side note , that Adams Avengers really was overlooked, for whatever reason Neal generates more heat , when he does DC stuff

GL Kyle (solid , more of a set-up, but still very good)
JLA Dark ( again all set up , but a very good handle on the characters , JLA goes Vertigo , lots of potential)
I Vampyre ( it took a couple of reads but was more satisfying with each read , definite Tarantino influence , almost like Tarantino doing a Vertigo book in the DCU , love the art)
Superman ( the main story was just meh , but this seemed to be more of an intro on the supporting characters in the Supes Universe and their new back story and personalities , on that aspect this worked really well , nice art also)
Hawkman ( i agree with above , a clever reboot , i am more interested then i ever thought i would be--the creators really stepped up here )


all in all , reboot Universe , was much better then i expected , like i stated before , i think the talent pretty much all stepped their game up , the question of course , why did it take a reboot?

if they do this right (please do not be Marvel and title overload on every success , i mean if Aquaman is doing well , one Aqua title is fine , Marvel kills my interest on Thor , IM , Cap (1 title is fine for any of these)

obviously the Batbooks work well with expansion , because the BatFam has so many popular characters
keep the Supes Fam at 4 books
the JLA titles are fine at 3
the GL titles work at 4 ( as they are all fairly popular characters)
the rest keep at 1


try some new things slowly , see what works , also wait on cancelling anything quickly , some of these new reboots may do well as trades, making it ok to keep publishing the singles (i know this is how the Vertigo model works)

take your time DC , you've built some goodwill here , on something most thought would fail

again , take your time , Dan , no need for rash decisions

let the books and talent create the excitement , if Events happen , have them be organic , growing from the titles

on to the #2's , it has been a fun month

[fulltimer56]

OK, guys,

Just as soon as Arthur gets back to work I guess I will have to make a few stops at my closest LCS and check out the new books... I know I will have to check out the Superman stuff (what can I say, I'm a Superman fangirl from WAY BACK) At least pick up the first few issues of the titles.. So what are the prices running on the new books? $3.99, $4.99?? Damn, I can't believe that I'm going to be willing to pay that kind of money for a comic book that can be read in like 15 minutes.. :-(

Linda

[nocutename]

OK, guys,

Just as soon as Arthur gets back to work I guess I will have to make a few stops at my closest LCS and check out the new books... I know I will have to check out the Superman stuff (what can I say, I'm a Superman fangirl from WAY BACK) At least pick up the first few issues of the titles.. So what are the prices running on the new books? $3.99, $4.99?? Damn, I can't believe that I'm going to be willing to pay that kind of money for a comic book that can be read in like 15 minutes.. :-(

Linda

Linda, most of the 1's are sold out and are being sold at a premium now. Perhaps the series you want will have second or third reprint of the first issue. But your best bet is to hold off and get them in trade format.

[comicmanshipper]

you may get lucky , i think all of them went to 2nd print (with the obvious variant cover)
95% are $2.99
i think 4 or 5 are $3.99 with extra pages
it will depend if the local shops ordered the 2nd prints
the Superman books should be obvious choices for stores , to order 2nd prints
Action #2 is also out now

[comicmanshipper]

some very cool news , this is a great pickup for DC ( now i am talking like they are a baseball or football team)

Ann Nocenti Takes On Green Arrow Beginning With Issue #7 (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/10/13/ann-nocenti-takes-on-green-arrow-beginning-with-issue-7/)
DC promised us some big New 52 creator announcements this week, and here’s an interesting one indeed:
Fan-favorite creator Ann Nocenti will be taking over as writer for GREEN ARROW in DC COMICS-THE NEW 52 – …

[custodes]

some very cool news , this is a great pickup for DC ( now i am talking like they are a baseball or football team)

Ann Nocenti Takes On Green Arrow Beginning With Issue #7 (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/10/13/ann-nocenti-takes-on-green-arrow-beginning-with-issue-7/)
DC promised us some big New 52 creator announcements this week, and here’s an interesting one indeed:
Fan-favorite creator Ann Nocenti will be taking over as writer for GREEN ARROW in DC COMICS-THE NEW 52 – …

I really loved her Longshot!

FLASH #!


I would like to add that I just read The Flash #1 (but, not 2 yet). When I was done I had the urge to reread it and study the art...WOW!

Story by Francis Manapul and Brian Buccellato.
Art by Francis Manapul
Colors by Brian Buccellato.

Wow again! These guys are real artists. Not just of the commercial kind. I mean the fine art kind. Good story too. Eagerly awaiting further issues.

[pasnat54]

I bought Demon Knights, both a second printing of #1 and the new #2. I liked it, and probably will continue buying it. I reminds me of the late, lamented Sojourn of the Crossgen Universe, which in turn reminds me of every other misfit band of fantasy adventurers going back to Lord of the Rings, but what the heck. The story of standing up to the invading hordes is usually fun, and the element of sibling rivalry adds to the interest.

I'm not sure I like making Madame Xanadu somewhat rougher, and as for having a thing for the bad-boy Demon instead of Jason Blood... seems too far out of character for her. But I suppose that's what the relaunch is for. I'll give this one a fair trial.

[stupidman]

Wow, you guys are being nicer than I expected from this crowd. Has anybody mentioned how terrible the art for Animal Man and Wonder Woman was? I mean really really shitty. The art in Flash wasn't much better, but still, I expected more. Go look at the Frankenstein book (no, wait don't) for more craptacular art. I wanted to buy Flash and Animal Man, but the art is way below my standards. And that's the problem with this reboot - 2nd string and no-name artists. I was hoping the "big New 52 creator announcements this week" would be some decent artists, but so far just a minor blip. I was psyched for the reboot but am more disappointed every week.

[pasnat54]

I guess the difference is started off with low expectations. I don't usually buy superhero books, so everything was pretty much new to me. I've follow a few supernatural books like Zatanna, Madame Xanadu and Shadowpact, but I had no idea what was going on with Batman, Superman or GL. The fact that I was not disgusted with the books may be considered faint praise, but in truth, I actually liked a couple; JLA Dark and Demon Knights.

As for the art, I've learned to temper my expectations. I like the fine linework of Russ Heath, and the realism of Neal Adams, but I also like stylized work... as long as the style isn't manga. In my 45 years of reading funny books, I've run across a lot of artists whose work I just couldn't get into, but there were none of those dealer-breaker artists among the books I read.

[comicmanshipper]

As for the art, I've learned to temper my expectations. I like the fine linework of Russ Heath, and the realism of Neal Adams, but I also like stylized work... as long as the style isn't manga. In my 45 years of reading funny books, I've run across a lot of artists whose work I just couldn't get into, but there were none of those dealer-breaker artists among the books I read.

I'm with you, nothing 90's Image (or late 80's/90's Indy type) horrible (and like you i am a major fan of Heath and Adams ), i am not a Liefeld fan , but juding from his reception at the NY convention , he still has his fans , and has seem to be have reached at least a near ok level in mind (or maybe i have just grown use to what to expect).

I like the WW art , fits the title well , and he was received like a "rockstar" at the NY con. Likewise Animal Man works for the title and along with Swamp Thing were the 2 non mainstream titles getting the most talk at the Convention (both 2nd issues read excellent)

And I am with custodes ,i love the Flash art
Frankenstein the story was just so entertaining , that i can live with the art

As i become older , the storytelling is more important , the art secondary , and i truly was expecting the worse on both counts, that i enjoy reading the new DC titles is a plus (not just doing it out of habit , like many of my Marvel books )

[fulltimer56]

Oh I know I will most likely have to get 2nd prints and I might just wait for the trade books like nocutename said... Maybe around Christmas?

Linda

[custodes]

And I am with custodes ,i love the Flash art
Frankenstein the story was just so entertaining , that i can live with the art

As i become older , the storytelling is more important , the art secondary , and i truly was expecting the worse on both counts, that i enjoy reading the new DC titles is a plus (not just doing it out of habit , like many of my Marvel books )

Yes, watercolors are very hard to do correctly. Are they right over the pencils? No ink? Think so. They have been studying their comic book masters as well as museum masterpieces. The perspective on some of the panels is very cool. Good use of art in storytelling. Sort of reminds me of the Addler greytone (washtones) covers in days of yore at DC.

I'm very impressed with them. Interesting division of tasks too. They have stated they are fans of Will Eisners' Spirit strip and will try to incorporate interesting title design in every issue. Looking forward to reading this.

edit: Also, like the way they represent the foreground, middle areas and backgrounds. Interesting. Kurtzman-like.

[stupidman]

"As i become older , the storytelling is more important , the art secondary ,"

That must be the reason that Humberto Ramos is still drawing Spider-Man, the art is secondary, lol. (Pasnat is right, Manga and psuedo-Manga artists are the worst).

Sorry, but I will never get that old that crappy art is acceptable or secondary. I'd rather stop getting modern comics than settle. Are my standards too high? I'm not sure any more. I thought they were, but now I'm thinking other peoples' standards are just too low. I'll know it's time to quit buying Moderns when I've "grown use to what to expect". Fortunately I don't have comic book OCD/ complete run-itis, so it's very easy to be fickle. There needs to be quality in both art and story, and that's a tough thing to find in comics these days. I mean, I expect crap from Marvel, but I thought DC was a cut above. And we wonder why no non-event comics can break 100,000 copies a month?

[toz1960]

"As i become older , the storytelling is more important , the art secondary ,"

That must be the reason that Humberto Ramos is still drawing Spider-Man, the art is secondary, lol. (Pasnat is right, Manga and psuedo-Manga artists are the worst).

Sorry, but I will never get that old that crappy art is acceptable or secondary. I'd rather stop getting modern comics than settle. Are my standards too high? I'm not sure any more. I thought they were, but now I'm thinking other peoples' standards are just too low. I'll know it's time to quit buying Moderns when I've "grown use to what to expect". Fortunately I don't have comic book OCD/ complete run-itis, so it's very easy to be fickle. There needs to be quality in both art and story, and that's a tough thing to find in comics these days. I mean, I expect crap from Marvel, but I thought DC was a cut above. And we wonder why no non-event comics can break 100,000 copies a month?
Ditto!

[comicmanshipper]

art is so subjective, that's the thing, but has a long time reader , there is good and bad in all era's of comic book publishing , though i would venture to guess there is more good stuff being published today then any other time in the various comic book era's.

the 100,000 number you mention , in all honesty , is pretty impressive, considering all of the things the monthlies have going against them today (people waiting for trades , people reading on the internet for free , people buying downloads , people not reading anything anymore , etc ) comics in general have kind of weathered "the print is dying" fever.

Better then just about any other genre of print , and when you consider the early70's thru the mid80's average DC sales levels , they are generally the same they are today.

I think the average sales levels today are pretty much the same they have been for the last 15 years for both DC and Marvel , though today they have all of the extra ways to make a buck, they didn't have before. We all know 1988 thru 1995 was a fluke, for everyone (sort of the same as the real estate bubble of 1994-2001 , in most areas homes will take 20-30 years to reach the level of that period)

The writing today in general ( DC and the Indys) is so much better , so much better! , though i would exclude Marvel from that statement.

I have found with art , what many people hate , other people love , it is just a matter of personal taste , the crowds that surrounded Liefeld in NY , attest to that , if you just read the internet , you would think this guy has no fans , but wow , they were waiting hours to meet the guy

Rob , i have to admit is a very personable guy , hell i talked to him , maybe two or 3 times in the last 10-15 years , and he remembered me , even asked where my (now) ex-wife was.

So now on to what will now be a controversial thumbs up,
but i have to mention it anyway , i kind of liked Hawk And Dove #2

I know lot of people do not , but i liked the crazy concepts Rob and Sterling are introducing , again not the greatest thing being published , but a good way to spend the commercial time between innings of the WS (by the way , this is a helluva good game tonight)

here is a review , that is kind of in line with what i thought

http://comicboxcommentary.blogspot.com/2011/10/review-hawk-and-dove-2.html

[comicmanshipper]

i had this in the other thread , should been published here

if you enjoy Ditko's Spider-Man
try Static Shock #2 , a step up from #1 , the book has the energy and personality of the young Peter Parker
my one worry , is that one of the creators is already moving on to another title , hopefully the others will compensate for the loss

a couple of links:
http://www.anthonynotes.com/2011/10/...tatic-shock-2/ (http://www.anthonynotes.com/2011/10/10/comic-review-static-shock-2/)

http://worldofblackheroes.com/2011/0...-the-villains/ (http://worldofblackheroes.com/2011/09/04/new-static-shock-meet-the-villains/)

http://www.comicsbulletin.com/review...2708034451.htm (http://www.comicsbulletin.com/reviews/13182708034451.htm)

[comicmanshipper]

speaking of no idea is new
OMAC #2 is just a lot of fun
big , nutty , concepts , i love this book

http://readrant.wordpress.com/2011/10/06/review-omac-2/
http://comics.ign.com/articles/119/1198548p1.html
http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=user_review&id=3997

ps this WS game is just getting better , have to go for good now

[stupidman]

art is so subjective, that's the thing, but has a long time reader , there is good and bad in all era's of comic book publishing , though i would venture to guess there is more good stuff being published today then any other time in the various comic book era's.

the 100,000 number you mention , in all honesty , is pretty impressive, considering all of the things the monthlies have going against them today (people waiting for trades , people reading on the internet for free , people buying downloads , people not reading anything anymore , etc ) comics in general have kind of weathered "the print is dying" fever.

Better then just about any other genre of print , and when you consider the early70's thru the mid80's average DC sales levels , they are generally the same they are today.

I think the average sales levels today are pretty much the same they have been for the last 15 years for both DC and Marvel , though today they have all of the extra ways to make a buck, they didn't have before. We all know 1988 thru 1995 was a fluke, for everyone (sort of the same as the real estate bubble of 1994-2001 , in most areas homes will take 20-30 years to reach the level of that period)

The writing today in general ( DC and the Indys) is so much better , so much better! , though i would exclude Marvel from that statement.

I have found with art , what many people hate , other people love , it is just a matter of personal taste , the crowds that surrounded Liefeld in NY , attest to that , if you just read the internet , you would think this guy has no fans , but wow , they were waiting hours to meet the guy

Rob , i have to admit is a very personable guy , hell i talked to him , maybe two or 3 times in the last 10-15 years , and he remembered me , even asked where my (now) ex-wife was.

So now on to what will now be a controversial thumbs up,
but i have to mention it anyway , i kind of liked Hawk And Dove #2

I know lot of people do not , but i liked the crazy concepts Rob and Sterling are introducing , again not the greatest thing being published , but a good way to spend the commercial time between innings of the WS (by the way , this is a helluva good game tonight)

here is a review , that is kind of in line with what i thought

http://comicboxcommentary.blogspot.com/2011/10/review-hawk-and-dove-2.html

Is there any artist you don't like?

[comicmanshipper]

there are plenty , but art is secondary for me , to storytelling,
so even if i hate the art, if the story is average or better , i can enjoy the comic


On the otherhand if the art is great but the story is lacking ( the last 10 years of Spawn for example) , i can skip it


Liefeld , i am not a huge fan , but i can give him a freepass for being such a nice guy, he really goes out of the way for his fans

[Hepcat]

i am not a Liefeld fan , but juding from his reception at the NY convention , he still has his fans , and has seem to be have reached at least a near ok level in mind (or maybe i have just grown use to what to expect).

I like the WW art , fits the title well , and he was received like a "rockstar" at the NY con.

Are you saying that the artist for Wonder Woman is Rob Liefeld?

:confused:

[comicmanshipper]

no ,

2 different people , the WW artist is Cliff Chiang

i was responding to the comment earlier in the thread about "Stupidman" not liking the WW art

big difference between the 2 artists , i like Chiang's art , as it reminds me of an artistic type , that you would have seen , in something like the "Big Book Of Mythology" that you were assigned to read , back in high school